General Discussion
From Cllr Wrigley's FB page
What will he reply or will he just delete/remove the comment on FB?
Best For Britain Prediction for Newton Abbot Constituency (which includes Dawlish)
https://www.getvoting.org/constituency/E14001381
Actually the commenter on Facebook need just take a closer look for the reasons (Now Zoomed in)
"This time, the Lib Dems have other targets in Devon and is not regarding Newton Abbot as a key seat."
and the same goes for the Labour Party. (ie the Labour Party does not regard Newton Abbot as a key seat to contest).
@Lynne. See my thread from earlier entitled 'Our Constituency is Neither a Lib Dem Nor a Labour Target Seat'.
Having said that it now seems the Lib Dems are't so sure whether Labour still see it as non-battleground or not and they are asking the local Labour Party to explain themsleves.
Why they think the Labour party should have to explain themselves to the feckless Lib Dems is weird. Especially after Wrigley and his Lib Dems got the local rag to print a lie about Labour not standing. Pompous Pr**ks..
That's from Lib Dem Cllr Cox, on Cllr Wrigley's FB page.
False narrative eh?
Here's an informative You Tube Video about tactical voting that was actually recommended by a Lib Dem to argue why to believe Wrigley when he claims to be the challenger tactical voters should unite behind.
What the Lib Dem overlooked is that the video does not recommend Electoral Calculus, which Wrigley uses on his FB post above, so it undermines their own argument. Electoral Calculus is not designed to predict elections.
@1263 I agree, but the problem is also misinformation. Politicians using graphs that may be accurate in relation to the purpose it was designed for but not in terms of what the politician wants you to believe. It's spin/misinformation. the problem is those people who blindly believe what they're told and conform without being inquisitive and checking for themselves.
Yes there are criticisms of Best For Britain highlighted by the Lib Dem, relating to Scotland and Consituencies where the Tory incumbent does not have the major vote share, but none that apply here.
In any case the Labour party member in the video, who does give a balanced and fair view, recommends the tactical vote site Stop The Tories whose poll currently has labour ahead of the Lib Dems; https://stopthetories.vote/parl/newton-abbot
Check out the link for yourselves, but bear in mind local factors are not considered, e.g. the rise of the South Devon Alliance recently, who will win thousands of votes.
This is the site Carol Vordermen recommends and it is committed to electoral reform, the Lib Dem failed to mention this site and nor does Wrigley as it doesn't serve their needs, it undermines what they want to achieve.
Watch for yourselves.
I've just clicked on the link given above (the 'stopthe tories' one) and it is giving no recommendation @today's date.
@Lynne I assume you're addressing me?
@Webmaster I'm exercising a right to respond generally, to clarify that's all. I do hope that's okay.
StopTheTories haven't given any recommendation yet. BestForBritain have; Labour.
Whenever I have referred to StopTheTories I've referenced their polls which have Labour ahead. That's all.
I have never written that they'd made a recommendation, ie. called it for one party over the other in this Constituency.
The video above claims StopTheToreis is the most credible.
Not my claim, those of the guy the video, which was recommended by a Lib dem on Wrigley's FB page.
I won't be tactically voting Labour or the Lib Dems to oust Anne-Marie Morris as already explained.
Polls do not take into account local factors, any polling should include all parties such as the South Devon Alliance and be based locally.
They're national polls, therefore not an accurate picture.
Why vote tactically anyway? Labour have this in the bag.
Anne-Marie Morris is a dreadful MP, however I would rather have her hold her seat in a Labour majority/landslide (where she can do less harm than under a Tory majority one would hope) than have Wrigley as MP in any government.
I do not tarnish all Liberal Democrats with the same brush, far from it Layla Moran speaks well and I support her views on Palestine. Wera Hobhouse the Lib Dem MP for Bath is a good politician I believe. I hear good work is done by Lib Dems in other areas of Devon. However many of them do not recognize Wrigley and the Teignbridge Lib Dems as part of the same party. And Ed Davey is a disgrace over the PO scandal - the coalition years should not be forgotten either. For that reason and on policies I see no discernible difference bewteen the Tories and the Lib Dems either. One gets into power on regularly in national government, the other doesn't other than by becoming a wing of the Conservative party in coalition. It's all right-wing and pro-corporate.
I hadn't heard of the Labour candidate until 4 weeks ago. I do not see any real difference betwetn Starmer's Labour and the Tories, he's a globalist politician that puts as much emphasis on undemocratic deals with corporate billionaires in Davos as he does on Westminster. Ultimately he's no different to Sunak, Braverman, Johnson, etc He also intruduced very punitive measures after the riots in the early 2010s which reprsents our 'democracy' becoming increasingly authoritarian and right -wing. The billionaires and media are queuing up to leave the sinking Tory ship and back Labour, that tells you there's no real difference or no true democracy.
The Labour candidate is only 21, he doesn't have a poor record in politics like Wrigley and Morris and out of those two Wrigley is far worse than Morris. There is no choice between these three, the concept of tactical voting just isn't relevant.
I completely detest the Tories and have done all my life. So when I state I would rather have Morris over Wrigley it is not without extremely good reasons - he's a complete disaster for this area, the worst sort of politician in a country where what we call democracy is in crisis.
In any case I'm voting for Liam Mullone of the South Devon Alliance because they at least listen to and engage with the people and know their role is to serve and reprsent us , rather than lord over us.
I would never vote Tory, Labour or Lib Dem. I'm opposed to these parties and I am fervently anti-Wrigley and anti-Morris because of their shocking records and based on my values and principles. Like I wrote I have a moral compass. I wouldn't vote Labour a party that nobody hears of until 4 -5 weeks before the election and is dormant while all the Lib Dem and Tory anti-democrtic dysfunction and corruption goes on in local government.
I'm not suggesting the SDA are perfect, but at least they're human beings and not party robots and ego-driven career politicians - and they have been fighting for local people for 5 years now, admittedly more NA centred, but change has to start somewhere.
There is no tactical vote locally between the main 3 parties. There's no choice just the least worst option, Labour's candidate, then sticking with Morris, then the most-worst option; Wrigley.
I hope that clarifies whatever I was being being pushed to admit?
I referred to tactical voting sites as the whole manic frenzy and scaremongering is interesting (and alarming) and irrelevant here and to expose the LIb Dems' blatant misinformation tactics and how Wrigley will use whatever it takes to win. I am unashamedly anti-Wrigley in this General election, any local elections and against him generally as a supposed public servant. And so what? I and many others are completely justified in that stance. People detested Thatcher, Johnson, Truss, detest Ed day too - with good reason. I'm not being critical of just some bloke in the street, so what's the problem? He entered politics, he conducts himself a certain way as does his party being more dictatorial than anything resembling democrats, his actions negatively impact thousands and were he MP it would get far, far worse. If he can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen, same goes for Lib Dem supporters or anyone else involved in politics.
Long post - hopefully I won't have to repeat myself over and over again saying the same thing because none of the above registers with some folk.
No doubt the witch hunters will brand me a Tory now. Haha - just look at Wrigley's local Lib Dem's and the local Tories under Bullivant and try to tell the difference.
You? Goodness me no.
I was addressing just anyone who happened to read this thread.
(And if you have a moan about my not addressing anything else you have written in your post above that's because I haven't read it. )
Would suggest most punters do not look at these type of polls as there fed up with all the bul#s^it that the 3 main parties con, labour and lib dems spew out , be it leaflet, social media, tv debates with one as bad as the other. Perhaps the decision this time is to vote for one of others either sda being the more "local" party or reform for a more country wide change party. Niether i think will win outright but hopefully it might be the start of changes to what we have been fed for years.
@1263 Totally agree, I'd rather have Liam Mullone from the SDA representing us in parliament as he has integrity, he stands up for the people and has a track record of tackling corruption even when subject to threats and abuse and Teignbridge District Council's Kangaroo courts. Whatever the outcome of this election the SDA will have greater exposure to more voters in the District, then it moves onto the County Council elections in 2025.
Reform is right-wing populist party, all right wing populist parties have links to authoritarianism, whilst far-right wing populist parties have links to fascism. A former BNP member was kicked out of Reform UK recently, so that tells us where they are on that right-wing continuum which is deeply concerning.
I get why election predictions are indicating Reform UK will do well, because of what @1263 describes above basically and I think it's understandable given Reform's anti-establishment rhetoric and when all mainstream parties function in the interests of the few and not the many, making deals with corporate and establishment elites; people look for an alternative. I don't think all Reform UK voters are racist or xenophobes, but I do think Reform UK will just become the Tory Party Mark 2, it could even merge with the Tory right and I don't believe Reform is as anti-globalist and socially and economically conservative as Farage makes out. I think they'll just become the neo-Tory party and default to the pro-corporate, pro-estrablishment neoliberal norm. It's a ltd company set up as a political party, Farage is the largest shareholder, just look at his background, private school educated, City of London commodities trader, etc... all very establishment. It all looks and sounds very Tory to me. Plus his party (then UKIP) didn't contest Tory seats in past elections whicg aided the right wing of the Tory party in exerting pressure over Brexit, shrinking the welfare state, plundering the country in general . Says it all really, just an alternative/false-throwback party for Tory voters.
I get why people are fed up, but he's not the solution. Reform UK is just a symptom of a broken country. But I understand why people want an alternative and to stick two fingers up at three main parties (or two main parties plus Lib dems I should write) with a protest vote because the're fed up, life has got harder and this nation is in regression.
For me the SDA is far more than a protest vote, they've done the hard yards. Where have Reform been when it has all been kicking off in local government? Nowhere. They've just turned up because it's election time, same as Labour. Wrigley's out and about a lot and visible - that's what some Lib Dem supporters argue. But so what? A failed local politician and with an illiberal and undemocratic approach is 'out and about a lot' - PR, always in election campaign mode, even when the election isn't on- no real substance, Big deal. The District would be better of without him. Morris and the Tories probably think they've given Wrigley enough rope to hang himself over Queen St in Newton Abbot, maybe he has been played. We'll find out on July 4th.