General Discussion
As the parliamentarians are not willing to carry out the will of the people through the democratic vote,
then here is another way not as yet suggested, and that being as Cromwell did the Disolving And closing this institution
called Parliament. After all if those members want to be ruled by the E.U. Then there is no reason to having a Governing body in London.
P.S would they mind not using the title M.P's use to each other as Honourable This and that.because as it stands that, is one title some of them are not worthy of using.
Tony Blair, what a little weasel.
He was on the Andrew Marr show recently, as usual going on about how great he is.
Wake up call Tony, no one likes you.
Interesting comments in the paper today by a certain Kevin Rudd.: yes, he who was the PM of Australia from 2007-2010 and again in 2013. What did he have to say about Brexit?
Writing about the idea that Australia, New Zealand and India have been 'advanced by the Brexiteers ..as the magical alternatives to Britain's current trade and investment relationship with the EU. This is the nuttiest of the many nutty arguments that have emerged from the Land of Hope and Glory....Its utter bollocks.'
On India: A substantive India-UK Free Trade Area is the ultimate mirage constructed by Brexiteers. Its as credible as the ad plastered on the side of that big red bus about the £350 million Britain was allegedly paying to Brussels each week. Not.'
On the USA: 'If No 10 still thinks its 'special relationship' with the White House will uniquely be capable of battering down the doors of the newly protectionist America, then good luck with that one..'
On the old empire:: the claim that 'it is just champig at the bit for Britain to cut itself loose from all those continentals in Europe. That too is bollocks.'
All of this strikes me as a fairly daming view about our prospects in the future. Whether or not we were once a great and proud nation has got litttle to do with, not only our present situation, but also the future.
The concept of failure is fascinating. One wonders what is meant? How was he a failure?
He won the 2007 election by a landslide: he adopted the Kyoto protocols; he provided apologies to teh stoilen generations of children removed from their homes by earlier governments; helped Australia avoid the worst of the 2008 worldwide financial collapse; began the roll out of the national broadband network amongst other things.
In other words, if these things are failures....
Of course he, like so many other politicians lose at some point but he seems to have done this with some grace and not petulance.
It is easy to dismiss his views in this sort of way: he's Australian (isn't that racist?) and its the Guardian? However, your comments offer nothing in teh way of a detailed critique but relay, as so many, on comments that add nothing to this debate.
Maybe you might like to address the poiunts he made?
OMG You Brexiteers 
If you are so sure it's the "will of the people" why are you so scared of a peoples vote on the final deal? Surely you'll triumph again or maybe you think Brexit may no longer be "the will of the people"?
Burnside needs to understand the political process. You win some, you lose some; its the nature of debate and reaching decisions.
However, I note that once again, maybe its always, he fails to provide any substance or evidence for his claims. Its just a throw away line of invective with no substance.
Maybe you need to read something. SInce you mention Wiki maybe you would see that he was a great champion of environmental matters with particlar reference to climate change and the Kyoto Protocols. It seems to me that even when in opposition, he maintained a principled approach to politics.
I was listening to that bellend Michael Heseltine on the radio this morning, apparently us plebs are way too thick to understand Brexit, only MPs are bright enough for that and to decide our future. His contempt for the voting public was astonishing. I was only surprised he didn't advocate abolishing elections completely to be rid of the annoying electorate.
What political process, how is it possible that 360 MP,s know better than 17,000,000 voters.
Our problems are man-made, therefore they may be solved by man...No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings.
Sarah Wollaston's proposal to have a second referendum was massively defeated in Parliament this afternoon, 334-85. Perhaps the voters of Totnes should have a "People's Vote" on whether she should remain their MP, as she no longer represents the party for which she was elected.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_producing_countries_of_agricultural_commodities#Fruits
The point is that the largest producers of fruit and veg are outside of the EU and as tariffs on goods from outside the EU are being cut to zero maybe things will be cheaper, i doubt that will be the case but one can always hope.
Busineses will jump on the band wagon. I remember when decimalization started. I said to a baker the day before it started, " how will the change affect you", he said, " well today I have got to make 240 penny buns to make a £, and tomorrow I will only have to make 100 to make the same £". To me that said it all.
EU REFERENDUM RESULTS 2016
BY VOTES
17.4m leave 16.1m remain
BY CONSTITUANT
406 leave 242 remain
CONSTITUANT BY PARTY
Lab 148 leave 84 remain
Con 247 leave 80 remain
BY REGION
9 leave 3 remain
BY MP
160 leave 486 remain
Brexit isn't the problem. It's our MP's who are the problem.
We don't know the votes by parliamentary constituency or ward as in majority cases it wasn't recorded. Votes were counted by area so not sure where that figure comes from. I haven't checked your other stats apart from the top one of course.
@S - I just copied those stats that Majorp posted and then did a search. Came up with this link http://www.ihysdb.com/Article/Comments/47627744/27?orderBy=0&descending=0
but just as with Majorp's post above there is no reference as to where the stats have come from
Here's a link with some more stats! The government website apparently crashed because of the numbers this very morning registering their wish that Article 50 should be revoked.
So.........when the government website is up and running again and if you want Article 50 to be revoked here is the link https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584
I see that many have been hitting this topic with doubt, that is their choice.
They are so rapped up in brexit, that no one seems to care a toss about terrorism or global warming and what we are going to do about it. Sad really! The world might rumble on, but the again it might not.
We might fall off a cliff over brexit, then again we might not.
The petition doing the rounds is being signed by people from all over the world, you only need to enter a fake UK postcode to sign it. Observation from Twitter this morning:
The 'Revoke Article 50' petition Remainers are all getting excited about is being signed by people everywhere from Russia & Saudi Arabia to Papua New Guinea & North Korea... I thought they were meant to be against foreign interference in our democracy?
There's even 220 signatures from tiny Luxembourg, Jean-Claude Juncker must have had a busy night
2 people have managed to sign the petition from Western Sahara, which isn't even technically a country. One of the Vatican City's 594 citizens also appears to have signed, the Pope trying to revoke Article 50 too?
https://twitter.com/HughRBennett/status/1108682038184419328
What are the flaws within the deal that May has negotiated. I hear there are many flaws but what are they?
As an IT consultant for over 20 years I can tell you that IP addresses aren't a 100% reliable indication of location due to software that hides a user's real location, ISPs IP allocation, proxies, VPNs etc. I would expect out of a million people a few hundred or more of the IPs would show the wrong country.
Major flaw to May's deal is the Northern Ireland backstop.
If at anytime the border system (whatever it is) between Northern Ireland and Ireland is deemed not to be working then we have to rejoin customs union and the single market.
With this ludicrous plan in place we can never do deals with the rest of the world. No other country can deal with us knowing that any deal can be broken. The whole idea is completely nuts. That is why MPs rejected it.
The UK doesn't need a border nor does the World Trade Organisation (WTO). It is the EU that wants a border, not the UK.
Thereas May is a remainer, she doesn't want to leave the EU.
Your explanation doesn't wash with me, this petition is being hjacked wholesale.
https://order-order.com/2019/03/21/foreign-actors-hijack-article-50-petition-fake-signatures/
Over a million signatures as I type this and I know for a fact that there could be more as I know people who have tried to register their names but who have been told to wait.
Talking of petitions. I see there was one earlier on this year advocating a No Deal Brexit. It garnered just over 370,000 supporters. I wonder if there was any foreign interference in that?
Putin must be rubbing his hands in glee as this mess just gets messier and messier.
But nuffin' to do with Theresa May you understand.
Internet petitions are worthless, the only vote that matters is the one done at the ballot box. Everybody from around the world can sign the current petition as many times as they like, it means absolutely nothing.
Over 1,010,000 are from the UK if you are believing the location data. You can read the data in JSON format on the site.
Does not overrule a non-legally binding referendum right? I don't think anyone signing the petition thinks that but it should be debated and considered a real option.
So the 2016 non-legally binding referendum overrules the 1975 non-legally binding referendum right?
Business are worried now, they want THE deal to go through. They say through their spokeswoman, "There are many benefits in the deal negotiated by Teresa May and all MP's should accept it". So MP's are having pressure put on them (which I always believed they would) by businesses.
I think this will go right to the wire
The petition on getting rid of the licence fee with over 100k was discussed in the clown room and after a while they just decided it was good value for money. Maybe if I was on an MPs salary I would not give a shit either. These internet petitions are just another tool used to make the sheeple think that we live in a democracy, I think not.
Brexit delayed by two weeks.
Again the EU doing whatever it can to thwart the will of the people.
An EU henchman looking very pleased with their underhand tactics.
er........excuse me. The EU is offering to delay Brexit. And the reason they are offering the delay is because Theresa May has asked them for one. And the reason she has asked for a delay is because the House of Commons won't agree to the the deal she thrashed out with the EU. So it is either a delay or crash out on March 29th. I appreciate that there are those who think that crashing out is fine. Others, thank goodness, think otherwise.
The only ball that is in the UK's court right now is to revoke Article 50 and once Brexit happens we won't even have that.
TAKE BACK CONTROL - REVOKE ARTICLE 50
er........excuse me. We voted out 3 years ago, May, MPs and the EU have done everything they can to thwart democracy.
How can staying in the EU be 'taking back control'?
The only reason the EU are agreeing to delay Brexit is because they are terrified of us leaving! I have friends who live in Holland and Germany and both tell just how terrified everyone is for the future of the EU without us! They need and want our money and will do anything to keep it!
If we revoke article 50 then we once again are in control of what happens to this country. We may still decide to leave but we can actually sort out what it is that we want and therefore how it is that we wish to achieve it. I appreciate that those who just wish to leave the EU with no deal will have no truck with that argument.
BUT at the moment the situation is that MPs do not want May's deal but they have not been allowed to discuss what it is that they might want (to still leave the EU please note in accordance with the outcome of the referendum but how? How? HOW?)
The minute, the very minute, we leave the EU then the EU is even more in control of this country's future then you claim that it is now.
Question - "Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?"
Answer - "Leave"
There are a lot of sore losers.
Stop saying the will of the people. 16 million didn't vote for it and nearly 13 million didn't vote at all. If it was 52% to 48% you wouldn't be saying "the will of the people" as your guiding light Farage said he would have fought that small a margin. We are trying to leave having wasted 2 years, arrogantly believing we can get any deal we want through. seeing the damaged it is doing and no one having a clue what no deal will mean. A series of Brexit ministers who don't seem to do anything and then leave. I don't see the point of Corbyn. He has provided no opposition. The whole Labour party might as well have been cardboard cutouts sat outside the Government. Time for the Liberals to step up then? (all 8 of them?) but I think they may have just gone on holiday for the last 2 years! (somebody should pop round and check on them just in case). The only vague opposition has been the SNP ... and I mean vague.
It is not about being sore losers, I would have accepted leaving if we had agreed on a deal and left but the Government have made a mess of it, we also now have a lot more knowledge (or should have if not blinded by our biases!) of what it all means. The EU isn't to blame for this mess or the mess of the country, that is and always has been down to the Government.
The vote was nearly 3 years ago or have you forgotten we get to vote again on the same things in a democracy after a few years?
What a load of smoke and mirrors. Joining the common market many decades ago may have been a good idea, but over the last forty years the common market has and is evovling into what will one day be a dictatorship of all europeans member states. All aspects of all member states will be dictated by the unelected few.
Anyone wishing to remain as a member of this corrupt regime, in my opinion, has a lower i.q. than a shrimp.
May the Remainer has blown hot and cold and delayed as much as possible to thwart the U.K. from having an orderly and planned exit for the e.u.
2 years, but a few days, since article 50 was implemented and the only real thing we have seen demonstrated is that the majority of m.p's have turned their backs on democracy and their constituents.
The current U.K. Government is not fit for purpose.
So now May has been given a 2 weeks extensions!
Yep, 3 years of this ridiculous remainiac pantomime.
Hard brexit, soft brexit, peoples' vote, no food, planes can't land, forced to eat chlorinated chicken, cancer risk increased, etc, etc.
What an utter disgrace. Should be very ashamed.
Over 80% of votes cast in the 2017 election were for parties that supported Brexit in their manifesto. How many more votes do you want? Internet polls don't count, obvs.
Parties had little choice but to mention and support Brexit in their manifesto for the 2017 election! Does that mean all the years Brexit wasn't mentioned that counts for remain?
Not sure how the EU can be a dictatorship when all 27 states have to agree! That's not how dictatorships work.
Labour, if it so wished, could have stood on an anti-Brexit platform, but fear of seeing its vote collapse ruled that out. The only national party opposing Brexit was the Lib Dems and witness what happened to them.
If you kept a closer eye on the news you would know that the EU wants to end national vetoes on taxation, so Brussels would rule on that. There are already other areas of policy where qualified majority voting applies and a national parliament CAN be overruled. Your assertion that all 27 states have to agree is wrong.
Over 3 million have now signed Revoke Article 50 petition.
Click on this link if you would like to do the same.
"EU wants to end national vetoes on taxation" they want to change from unanimity to qualified majority voting so a single national couldn't block legalisation and the tax they are talking about isn't national tax rights in the first phase. The second phase may affect VAT but not touch income tax.
You are right they don't have to agree on all changes to legalisation but still a majority voting system isn't a dictatorship!
I'm glad you have acknowledged that the EU will have control over aspects of member states' taxation affairs, even if not all states agree with that. You would be foolish to think there wouldn't be mission creep, and eventually income tax rates would come under the control of Brussels. As it stands, the EU has to approve the national budget of states who are in that folly called the Eurozone, only last autumn the EU forced the Italian government to rewrite its budget because it disapproved of its spending plans. Thank Christ the British people have seen sense, and we are getting out.
Do you seriously think MPs pay any attention to petitions, online or otherwise. I didn't realise you were so naive.
Face the facts... It turns out that no scenario puts the UK in a better standing than our current situation and any Brexit scenario leads to sh*t. You had your chance.... peoples vote so the sane can restore sanity 
May's treachery will cause riots.
At the end of the day she puts the EU above the UK.
I doubt she has ever said anything truthful.
At the end of the day May has put the interests of the Conservative Party above the interests of the UK.
Just as Cameron did.
Which is why we are in this mess.
Revoke Article 50 petition just shy of 4 million as I type this. click on this link to sign https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584
TAKE BACK CONTROL - REVOKE ARTICLE 50
Some of the EU's finest achievements
Browser cookie law, but browsers already had the functionality to disable cookies.
Weights and measures, tried to ban us from using pounds and ounces.
Fish discards, throwing away perfectly good fish when we have food banks.
Our fishermen going out of business while foreigners can fish in our waters.
Each month, move between Brussels and Strasbourg, costing £150m a year.
UK prevented from sending hook hand the hate preacher to the USA.
UK prevented from sending Abu Qatada to Jordan.
EU had a debate on whether artificial intelligence should have human rights.
EU has great animal welfare, what about bull fighting?
EU encouraging Spain to bring up Gibraltar again and again.
Northern Ireland border issue is all the EU's fault.
Then there is the VAST amount of money they take from us, which could go to our struggling hospitals.
Brexit costing UK £500M a week, study says. Brexit vote causes £26B annual loss to the UK economy, according to Centre for European Reform. The British economy is 2.5 percent smaller today than if the U.K. had voted to remain in the European Union, according to the Centre for European Reform, a think tank.30 Sep 2018
Brexit costing UK £500M a week, study says – POLITICO
https://www.politico.eu/article/brexit-costing-uk-500m-a-week-study-says/
How much has Brexit cost the UK? | The Week UK
https://www.theweek.co.uk/93785/how-much-money-has-brexit-cost-the-uk
5 Mar 2019 - The economic impact of the Brexit vote is being felt even as the clock ... since 2016, £4.2bn has been made available for Brexit preparations.
Brexit Has Already Cost the U.K. More than Its EU Budget Payments ...
https://www.bloomberg.com/.../u-k-brexit-hit-already-exceeds-eu-budget-payments-st...
22 Jun 2018 - The damage to the U.K. economy caused by the vote to leave the European ... 23 billion pounds ($30 billion) in lost tax revenue, the think tank said. ... since it gets back around 9 billion pounds from the EU, though that didn't ...
How much has Brexit cost so far? The UK has lost a lot of cash since ...
10 Dec 2018 - Brexit chaos continues this week with no one seeming to have a clue what is going to happen over the coming days, weeks and months. A vote ...
The UK economy since the Brexit vote — in 6 charts | Financial Times
https://www.ft.com/content/cf51e840-7147-11e7-93ff-99f383b09ff9
10 Oct 2018 - As Brexit negotiations reach a climax, how is Britain's economy doing? ... “The UKeconomy has probably grown more slowly due to the ...
Brexit costing UK £500M a week, study says – POLITICO
https://www.politico.eu/article/brexit-costing-uk-500m-a-week-study-says/
30 Sep 2018 - Brexit costing UK £500M a week, study says. Brexit vote causes £26B annual loss to the UK economy, according to Centre for European Reform. The British economy is 2.5 percent smaller today than if the U.K. had voted to remain in the European Union, according to the Centre for European Reform, a think tank.
Cost of Brexit to UK economy running at £40bn a year – Bank rate ...
https://www.theguardian.com/.../brexit-has-cost-uk-economy-at-least-80bn-since-vote-b...
14 Feb 2019 - The cost of Brexit to the British economy is running at £40bn a year ... The Bank hascalculated that the cumulative total of lost GDP since 23 ...
Brexit costing Britain £500m a week and rising, says report | Politics ...
https://www.theguardian.com/.../sep/.../britain-bill-brexit-hits-500-million-pounds-a-wee...
29 Sep 2018 - Economy 2.5% smaller than it would have been if UK had voted remain, ... Brexit isalready costing the public purse £500m a week, new ... Public finances have been dented by £26bn a year, more than half of the defence budget. ... to persuade the company to move manufacturing to France after Brexit.
Brexit cost: How much has Brexit cost the UK so far? | Politics | News ...
https://www.express.co.uk › News › Politics
14 Nov 2018 - With Britain due to leave the European Union in March 2019, the hope will ... Brexit cost: Brexit is costing the UK £500 million a week - or £26 ...
I expect Brexit has cost some money. I voted out knowing full well that it would as any sensible person would.
It is a price worth paying to remove the EU leech. Overall we will be far better off.
There is no way that it is costing half a billion a week. Surely you don't actually believe that?
Well it seems a lot of economists and those of similar ilk have looked at the stats and come to that conclusion.
Though of course one does have to bear in mind that they are experts............
In addition to all the fake signatures on this petition, we now learn that the originator has made threats against Theresa May's life, and even wrote about procuring a firearm. Aren't these Remoaners a lovely bunch?
Well we all know what an expert is don't we? They all make mistakes, and with this guessing game, how many have got it right and how many have got it wrong?
I am perplexed. If, as they say many people did not know what they were voting for back in 2016, Why did they vote?
Margaret Anne Georgiadou said she has received three death threats over the phone and had her Facebook account hacked. On Saturday morning, the petition reached well over 4,000,000 signatures and became the most signed protest in history. ... They included death threats, harassment and physical assaults.4 hours ago
Top stories
Web results
On the matter of alleged fake signatures on the petition. I have no idea if that is true or not but if some Leave supporters have been indulging in that then how ironic that they have been helping to bolster the numbers registered as supporting the petition.
PS Great turn out in London today. Wonder if any Leave supporters were there intent on subverting but inadvertently boosting the numbers?
So the woman who allegedly threatened Theresa May is complaining she has received death threats. You couldn't make it up.
And just look at what c**p all the Leave campaign promises have turned out to be.
PS Revoke Article 50 petition just shy of 5 million as I type this. Click on this link if you would like to sign it.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584
TAKE BACK CONTROL - REVOKE ARTICLE 50!
How many more times does it have to be said. The Leave campaign was a cross party group to campaign for our exit from the EU, it was NOT the government and could NOT promise anything, it could only suggest alternatives if we were no longer bound by the EU. It really isn't that hard to understand.
lol Brixidiots make me laugh. They are like hardcore Trump supporters. It's either fake news, project fear or cyber-web bots
Get real, you've been hoodwinked by Victorian comic characters, self-serving tax avoiding elitists and over-privileged buffoons and convinced that national self-harm is the answer to the shitty state this government has led our country into 
What do you know that the rest of us don't know, that makes you think you are right. This is one game where facts and figures don't mean a thing, it has never been done before so there are no facts but maybe plenty of dodgy figures to go on.
I don't believe for a second that the EU wants to become this superstate that some people believe but if it did and tax and budgets are set centrally (no different to the UK now and regional areas). The UK had a massive influence in the EU and it would have still been our MPs and MEPs discussing and voting on each bit of legalisation. Let's assume everyone gets to vote in the election of the leader of the EU.
What would the negatives be? Genuine question and hope there are well thought out answers rather than "we lose power over ourselves" or some other old rhetoric because let's face it the person on the street as very little power now.
@Paul concerning the benefits of being the EU I already know your answer "... we would still have that"
This is @Scapegoat's description of Brexit which I love so much I'll repeat it again here.
Brexit - They promised us unicorns. They gave us a lame donkey with an ice-cream cone on its head.
The petition has 5.4 million signatures now. If it is so easy to fake why did the "leave with no deal" petition only get 540k signatures (and by the way got a response and a debate in Parliament)? Although some of those signatures look "dodgy"
{"name":"United States","code":"US","signature_count":655},{"name":"Uruguay","code":"UY","signature_count":35},{"name":"Uzbekistan","code":"UZ","signature_count":16},{"name":"Vanuatu","code":"VU","signature_count":11},{"name":"Vatican City","code":"VA","signature_count":3},{"name":"Venezuela","code":"VE","signature_count":3},{"name":"Vietnam","code":"VN","signature_count":21},{"name":"Wallis and Futuna","code":"WF","signature_count":3},{"name":"Western Sahara","code":"EH","signature_count":1}
To name a few:
Freedom to work/reside/study/retire in any of the 28 countries
Common EU regulations on the transportation and disposal of toxic waste
European Regional funding - Cornwall and Wales benefitted massively from this and our Government won't replace those lost funds
Tariff-free trade with the EU
We have health and safety, working rights (working time directive) and paternity/maternity leave due to EU regulations as well as a bunch of other regulations that have improved life. May and a bunch of Brexiteers MPs opposed the Working Time Directive!
I guess it depends on what someone views as important. For me that seems scant return for the billions we are charged.
This thread has been closed.