General Discussion
Now you know why the councils have spent millions on cycle paths. So they can reduce the subsidies on buses and trains. Makes perfect sense to a civil servant, build 1000s of new homes with no new infrastructure or local employment, then cut out the public transport to the places were there are jobs and shops etc. Next news will be the railway moving out to sea and trains no longer stopping at Starcross and Dawlish. Seems like it will be back to horses and carts next. Supose they will not spend any money on upgrading and maintaining the A379 either so we become even more cut off. Just hoping all these cut backs are reflected in lower council tax bills next year, because we shouldnt be paying for services not being provided nor to support a district 2nd tear council like TDC which isent fit for purpose.
Yes, I have to say that all this cutting back on public transport is ironic given that one of the reasons put forward for Dawlish having lots of new development is because of the good public transport links it has (had?).
BTW can someone put the petition link on EoD please. I don't have a fb account. Also if any of you are on fb and twitter can you send out the link please and also email friends and ask them to sign. Thanks.
More info: I've been told that the cuts
Since moving to Dawlish nearly 15 years ago I have seen a steady decline in investment in those things that are the bedrock of any town. I have witnessed the council(s) spend large sums of money with either no interaction with the local communities. Or when they do totally ignore the input.
I have witnessed millions being spent on new housing estate's, comprising hundreds of houses without any thought for increased infrastructure to support education, employment, drainage, transportation/vehicular access and sewage.
I have observed over a million pounds spent on a change to the Dawlish high street at the cost of the trader's profits being impacted and the end result of the expensive paving a kin to dirty concrete slabs.
I have seen prohibition notices erected all over The Lawn, but little or no enforcement of this action.
It is sad that those elected by us to assist and improve our town/county go out of their way to do just the opposite and it's not like the rates are low either.
Lastly, I am just waiting for the announcement for the change of bin collections to go from the current alternate weekly collection to alternate fortnights.
I made a point at looking at all the buses passing my home yesterday from 1600 to 0015 and 40% were empty the rest had no more than 10 passengers. So we pay our taxes to have empty double deckers running round is it not the same old story if you dont use the service you lose it. Now i know the importance of a good bus service but the operators don't care about that all they want is profit because thats how the system works and without subsidies they make a loss. So the question is would you provide a service and lose money.
Yes i know that but why should we i dont get subsidised for running my car, have just watched 6 buses pass my home with a total head count of 12 two were empty that cannot be sustainable and its wrong on so many levels. We have large heavy buses running empty polluting the air we breath and damaging our roads, so i ask again would anyone provide a bus service and lose money i know i wouldn't.
Would smaller buses use less petrol/diesel over the same route?
Just thinking along the lines of a mini bus type of service.
It would be interestimg to know from Stagecoach just exactly how bad the financial figures are. Outside of the holiday season does anyone actually pay to travel on the hop 2 service. Ive only ever seen it full of school children or OAPs both of which get free passes. Maybe a re-think on the timetable is justified. What about a dual system of one timetabled bus every hour and one on kind of standby that only leaves Exeter or Newton Abbot when its full.
Maybe we should get rid of the trains, buses and cycle track and build an elevated linear motion monorail system
It looks to me that the service is little used after 1600 so why not reduce buses to one every hour or as Lynne has mentioned a small bus, mini bus service. Stagecoach at the moment recieve a subsidy i presume that covers the cost of running the service once that goes they will cut the service, they know what buses are profitable from ticket sales. Now we tend to take it for granted there will always be a bus, a telephone box,toilets, trains, doctors, etc etc but as i have said many times before " you aint seen nothing yet" this is only the start it will get worse. Merry Christmas.
As far as I am aware bus passes are only free of cost to those who use them, as the fares still have to be paid for.
So, who pays for the fares? Local councils. And where do the local councils get their money? From council tax payers and from central government via the national tax take. But central governemnt has restricted how much money local councils can raise via council tax. This has, and is, causing all sorts of problems in terms of what monies local councils have to spend and what they spend it on.
BTW It costs more to travel locally on the bus than it does to travel on the train
An example: The cheapest way to travel to/from Exeter on any particular one day is by way of the one day Explorer ticket. I believe that costs £7.50 full price, £6.50 for those over 60 (but who are not old enough to qualify for a 'free' bus pass). Only available I believe outside of the rush hour period.
If locals buy a one year Devon and Cornwall Railcard for £10.00 (and that isn't age restricted) then they can get a third off railfares in Devon and Cornwall provided they travel off peak times. Via this card the return railfare Dawlish/Exeter is about half the cost of the bus ticket for the same journey.
I wonder what percentage of folk use public transprt? The reason i ask is the last time i used a train or bus was probably 50 years ago.
I don't know that percentages come into it - surely it is more a question of whether or not the numbers make the provision of a service viable or not.
But even if the % were to be small, if that % has no recourse to private transport then the only option open to them is public transport. So what happens if that public service is removed/cut back?
It is noticeable to me how many elderly women use buses during the daytime.
And the more private cars there are on the road the more the road gets used (more repairs needed?) and the more air pollution there is?
You can build as many cycle paths and run as many buses as you want but folk will not give up there cars its how it is and nothing will change.
I'm not suggesting that people who have cars will stop using them. What I am saying is that there are people who do not have cars and therefore have no option but to use public transport.
The key to running a sucessful public bus service on a semi rural service such as the hop 2 route has to be flexibility. There is no way a fully timetabled service will work to provide profitability and at the same time cut out wasteage. Stagecoach know full well what times of day and night they need to provide service and how many vehicles they need on the road to cover this. Its local government who know nothing about running a profitable service who impose the timetable requirement. There is absolutly no point in running four buses an hour if three of them spend most of their journey empty.
Maybe a small shuttle bus running circular from just Sainsbury's Dawlish to Morrisons Teignmouth would take care of the pensioner bus pass requirement stopping at both town centres I refer to Dawlish on this and mean stop on the Strand as well as the beach front.
Train passenger numbers have increased hugely over the last five years but investment in rolling stock hasn't, consequently our trains at peak times are full and standing and a nightmare to use. But...........people use them because train travel is so much cheaper than bus travel. Stagecoach, who operate our local bus services, are well known for their greed and rip off prices! The buses may well be underused but if they were more affordable then more people would use them! I have a car but never use it to travel to Exeter as it is cheaper and quicker to use the train. Same goes for Plymouth.
Having used the bus to Exeter for the last two days I can confirm that the buses are used extensively after 5:00 pm. The problem over low usage seems to revolve around the very poor timekeeping of the route 2 buses. In the trip up to Exeter on Monday I counted 7 buses coming the other way, they are supposed to be 20 minutes apart but at least 4 buses were only 5 minutes apart so one of the two buses picks up no one, hence the so called lack of passengers.
If only the route controllers at Exeter would make sure that buses ran 20 minutes apart and before people jump on me I know there are problems with traffic flow on the route but the controllers must be able to make sure that the space between buses is better.
Why not complain, it may help :-
https://www.stagecoachbus.com/regional-help-and-contact/south-west/complaints-and-feedback
Got told today about the Exeter Day rider Plus ticket which costs £5.50.
Click on this link to see the area it covers (it includes Dawlish)
Thank you to the person who told me about it.
Do you have to be in Exeter to buy this ticket? If so what is the benefit? I am only aware of the plus bus ticket, which if you buy when you buy your train ticket you can travel on all Exeter bus routes for an additional £2 but it only covers Exeter. You can of course buy day rider tickets but I don't know how much the one which covers Exeter costs. The one covering Torbay is about £4.50, which is still more expensive than the equivalent ticket on the north coast!
Well, the person who told me about it lives in Dawlish and uses it.
You buy it from the bus driver just as you would any other ticket