Dawlish Discussion

Devon and Cornwall Police are keen to educate motorists to reduce their speed which will have an impact on the amount of people injured or killed following a collision in or with a speeding vehicle.

A Community Speed Watch scheme is starting on Thursday 13th August in the areas of Cofton, Cockwood, Starcross, Powderham and Kenton and will be run by local volunteers fully supported by the local police. They will be called the West Exe Community Speed Watch Team.

New volunteers are always welcome. If you are interested in this exciting and valuable PVP volunteer role please contact Pc Rob Harvey of the Teignmouth & Dawlish Rural Neighbourhood Team, either by phone on 101, or by email
15854@devonandcornwall.pnn.police.uk

Excellent news! Thank you for sharing this. 

It's far from excellent news just vouluntees who have no powers to stop fine or advise speeding motorists all that will happen is a letter will be recieved by the motorist who has been speeding to advise him not to in future.  This is another case of Policing on the cheap and will have little inpact on speeding motorists fines and points stop folk speeding not a letter advising you have been a naughty boy and don't do it again.

Vigilanties in action. Sad, Sad people with nothing better to do. Get a life people have work to do around here. Speeding through Starcross, now thats got to be a joke

You'd rather save a barren field than save a life? 

Whilst caravans in the summer and lorries all year round cause chaos at Starcross pillars, there are still plenty of idiots who speed at over twice the limit along the stretches immediately either side of the pillars. 

I can't believe that people are against this idea. I hope it gets extended into Dawlish and Holcombe. 

I don't think anyone is against motorists being forced to abide by speed limits.

I think what is being discussed is the suggestion that volunteers should somehow be involved. See Leatash's comments above. Will these volunteers have any clout?

And what happens if there aren't any volunteers? 

PS Just did a search on Community Speed Watch schemes. Seems they are being rolled out throughout the country. Does make me wonder what next bit of our public services will be hived off to voluntary workers.   

@OurSoul

So you condone the Police for putting the vigilanties lives at risk by having them stand by the roadside pointing cameras at members of the public Im quite sure the HSE would advise against such on a busy main road. They could also face private prosecution under the data protection act which covers the use of CCTV etc in public places, not to mention the EU human rights act amongst others. In fact they have no rights what so ever to be doing this and could even risk personal assualt and injury by doing so.

Yes there are the odd idiots that speed through residential areas the same as the ones that regularily drink and drive but its not the general publics business to deal with them. The police have adequate powers under section 59 to deal with the boy racers and thats part of what they are paid and warranted to do.

I may be wrong but the 30 limit imposed on the stretch of road between the harbour and Starcross cannot be enforced due to the road not meeting the requirements for such, ie not in a built up area and not covered by the required road lighting. The topic of miss used road markings etc has been discussed on another thread and is again not down to the public but the local authorities.

If anyone is against speeding it's me, i have attended a number of fatal accidents and it's not only the cost to the tax payer but the destruction they cause to families.  If we want to stop speeding look no further than the A38 Plymouth to St Austel every village has average speed cameras always working no one speeds, and those who believe they can pay in fines and points, the revenue generated stays in County and is ring fenced for road safety. The volunteers probably have good intentions but a SWARM  of high vis individuals standing on the side of the road with a speed gun is not the answer hit the speeders where it hurts points and fines.

Leatash, I'd much rather have the safety cameras than the volunteers. If only everyone else thought so then the roads would be a far safer place. 

Cornwal County Council are rolling out average speed cameras across the County why? because they work.

I use on the stretch of road in question every week to visit my son.  I would LOVE to be able to do the speed limit!  The nature of the roads, the pillars, parked cars, double decker buses, HGV's and don't forget the caravans and lost tourists provides year round traffic calming.   

This is just a publicity stunt to keep some vocal locals happy and put a positive spin on the police. 

State sponsored snoops are just asking for abuse at best and a smack in the mouth at worst.

Good luck to Cornwall County Council for finding the money to install multiple average speed cameras, hope they install them in accordance with the DofT guidelines with adequate warning signs posted at the required distances etc. "Bet they dont". Stinks a bit of a cash cow to me and incidently isent there a requirement for an area covered by any type of fixed speed camera to have an identifiable accident black spot history. There seems to be an awful lot of rule bending going on in order to raise money from soft target motorists. Like civilians manning Police marked mobile camera vans thereby impersonating warranted officers. All this activity does is discredit the real campaign for road safety.

Here's a few ideas

1)  Introduce Jay walking rules (especially outside Harrisons and the bottom end of the Strand)

2)  Compulsary passing of the cycling proficiency test, and the display of a visable ID No similar to a reg plate plus insurance for all road using cyclists. Also make it a fineable offence not to use  a designated cycle path when avaiable

3) Bring back the provision of a copy of the highway code to all school children and lessons in class time to explain its content

4) Re instate the Green Cross Code adverts even making them a pop up on childrens websites

You could also argue that if every motorist parked legaly. never broke the speed limit, payed there insurance, had legal number plates, always indicated when changing direction, didnt use there mobile, i could go on there would be no need for enforcement and i don't ride a bike.

@leatash

I have also covered fatal RTCs as a recovery driver on a much busyier and faster road than the A379 namely the M62, so I fully understand your pointf view. However when it comes to car to car accidents I dont believe that speed is always the common denominator. Todays vehicles offer quite good human protection even at crash test speeds of 50 mph and providing the safety systems are not compromised ie seat belts, air bags etc most minor car crashes should be survivable.

Valid issues raised at a Vehicle dismantlers association meeting concered the severity of injury when the individuals drive unsuitable cars and therefore are more  likely to become trapped in the vehicle. Here we observe large overweight persons driving tiny little hatchbacks and most worrying cars modified for the disabled use apart from the means of entry and exit.

Until recently I believe fatal RTCs were declining and Im convinced that this new generation of tiny cars contribute to the now increasing figure.

Also I would consider movement restrictions on HGVs at certain times, as in parts of Europe. The motorways are choked with supermarket arctics which should be restricted to night time deliveries

Coming soon................

Volunteers to empty rubbish bins from the street to save the council money

Volunteers to cut the grass in your  town  to save the council cost

Volunteers to investigate burgarlies  because the police are short on manpower

Volunteers to spy on all public acivities..............oh sorry we  already do that with the jobs worths for cars in starcross

Feel free to add your own .

@leatash

Yes, you right to point out that some people do break the law - which is exactly why the Police should be doing the enforcement,  not high vis snoopers.

When I'm driving my totally legal vehicle,  at the speed limit I won't appreciate my attention being taken from the road by a bunch of legally endorsed busy bodies loitering on the pavement. 

Oh, and I do ride a bike.  I have lost many friends over the years to 'cagers' (biker slang for car drivers).  Driver (and sometimes rider) inattention has been the common denominator - not speed.

On this volunteering issue.

Suggest only those who voted Tory should be eligible.  

Is that because they'll  make a  better job of it?

to be fair @Lynne i'd imagine only those who voted tory would volunteer anyway.

@Lynne

Maybe the ones that voted Tory could atually stand in the middle of the road with their radar guns preferably in a narrow spot.

Next Up - Volunteer to pay extra council tax for further reductiions in public services.

Or donate to Fridays Conserative jolly at the railway station, no doubt the town council will be laying on a trough and free drinks at the manor house or even the Langstone. You would think Britain had never undertaken a civil engineering project of this nature before. To some companies this job would have been small fry and taken lot less time

...and would have cost taxpayers a damn sight more. 

@FB. Whats this got to do with this thread about speeding motorists? Free drinks on offer on Friday eh, great Idea.  

@ stephen - Just replying to woodcocks comment thats all

@OurSoul - what another stupid remark the same company responsible has just been fined two million pounds cause they cant even run trains on time. perhaps the tax payers should be celabrating that on friday

Why is it a stupid remark?  You're linking two separate issues in that post at 10:34 in order to prove an irrelevant point.

So would you please demonstrate, factually rather than sensationally, that a private enterprise doing the same job to the same exacting standard would have done so for less money. 

A word to the wise FredBassett, don't  fall into the trap.........

What trap's that Elvis?  Not allowing someone to express their view if it's at odds with your own?    Why should FredBassett get away with posts like that?  Shame the Webmaster is a lightweight, but I've reported it anyway.  Whatever you think of OurSoul I'd hope there are a few decent posters who report it too, because it's plain offensive. 

I quite agree it is offensive, OurSoul is sharpening up in her old age.

I don't doubt the OurSoul haters will enjoy it, which is all you need to know about their sort. 

@Netiquette - you saw how high the webmaster jumped with the carnival thread but is asleep at the wheel the rest of the time.  I've reported it too, but don't hold your breath.  What a load of bollocks. 

@ FB Post, 10.34am, sorry about that did not realize.

I notice that both Netiquette and A frame are relatively   newcomers to this forum, I suggest that before they jump to anyone's  defence, they care to look back at the track record of OurSoul , where the lady had used various  identities and had been banned from here on each occasion.

The lady has realised at long last that there  are more ways of killing a cat.

Why is it that folk no longer have meaningfull conversations on this forum anymore every post gets skewed into a slanging match and goes miles of track

Thanks from me to those that are standing up to the bullies on my behalf. It's appreciated. 

Elvis, I've already explained why I've had to use different identities - and it wasn't to deceive anyone in case that's what you're trying to imply.  It was because of the bullying crowd also bullying the webmaster into banning me.  Could you please explain what you mean by your last sentence in your 20:40 post today?  Thanks. 

I  didn't  imply anything.

You brought on to yourself all that happened to you with your libelous comments about me and others. It doesn't  wash that you were bullied  off, just try looking back at your posts. It's  no good for you to act as the injured party, that won't  wash either.

I believe that now you are changing your modus operandi , almost clever, but not quite.

Oh and by the way, it's  Mr Presley to you.

And still the king of rock and roll.

I'd be very interested to know what the libellous comments were Elvis! Please share or retract that allegation. 

I don't have an MO, other than to provide an alternative point of view to the noise that this forum makes. So no, my MO hasn't changed - unless you mean that I'm no longer responding to the trolls on here in the same tone that they use?  Maybe you could do with being a bit more blunt and state what you actually mean, instead of using all this couched language in your inferrals. 

Oh dear been reported to the teacher, wondered when it would be my turn. Never mind ill go and sit in a corner with my pointed hat on. Now what user name shall I use next just in case I get banned from such an informative forum site.

There are plenty in your kitchen drawer, Phredd. :-)

Well you wrote the libelous comments, perhaps you should seek help over your amnesia and any other problems you might have.

Won't  tell you again it's  Mr Presley.

No Elvis, you're making the accusation of libel, so if you could please let me know or retract your allegation that'd be great. Thanks Elvis. 

No chance  and the second word is off. Sleep well.

Apology accepted Elvis. 

Help me out here Mr Presley, whats a kitchen

It wasn't  an apology, the lady has had so many posts removed for their content that one would be hard pressed to find one. 

I may be a relatively new poster to this forum Elvis, but I've been reading it for a while.  What libel are you talking about?  

I make no apologies for leaping to anyone's defence, that's what I do when I see the hawks circling.  It reminds of the school bullies who always had a few shadowy mates sniggering with them egging each other on.   It's the same on here and I'm sorry to say it looks like you're one of them.

Apperances are deceptive,  I  have already said,  that most of her posts that were innapropriate were removed. You shouldn't  be making judgements about subjects or people  that clearly you know nothing about.

If you care to look back at the posts Judith Chalmers AKA OurSoul had removed , it may give you a small insight.

In addition  before you condem me as a bully, I suggest   that you look back   at my posts.

Let sleeping dogs lie.  There was no libel. 

Firstly,  back on track.   I drove along the a379 from Exeter to Dawlish last night at 9pm.  The road was completely clear.   Even with a completely clear road, the nature of the bends, pillars and parked cars did not allow me to exceed the speed limit to any kind of excess (no more than +10%).  My personal conclusion is that you do not have a speeding problem.   You may have incompetent drivers or people unfamiliar with the roads but to say it's some kind of race track is just not true.  Possibly on two wheels, if you knew the road,  you could wind it on, but hardly a reason for high vis busy bodies. 

Secondly,  I don't give a flying whatnot who these volunteers voted for.  If they can't find a more worthy cause to support (befriending an elderly person, helping out in a charity shop etc) then they have my sympathy as I believe their priorities as a human being are skewed. 

Thirdly,  I am reluctantly commenting on the above bun fight.  When I first joined this forum I was warned by Elvis not everyone was nice.   So I took a look through previous threads.   

Unfortunately I saw the posts from the previous incarnations of OurSoul and didn't realise it was the same person.  They were vile, hate filled rants full of name calling and insults against members of posters families so  I have to reluctantly agree with Elvis on some levels. 

These posts have since disappeared.  However I can confirm they existed and it put me totally off this site.

It is possible the person concerned is trying to turn over a new leaf. I hope so.  We all make mistakes and the clever ones among us learn by them.

There is an issue with speeding.  If you've ever tried to pull out of a side street where the speed limit is 30mph and nobody does that, it's really difficult to pull out.  How many times have I pulled out of my road when it's clear, only to have some delightful driver speed up so they're right up to my bumper beeping and flashing lights. 

I do not however agree with these volunteers, it is, I fear, a recipe for disaster. Wait for the first road rage incident.

Has anyone seen them in action yet. If so and you recognise them why not name and shame them on here. My suspision is the majority are a brought in rent a mob and dont even live locally.

The 2 i know have recently moved to Dawlish i don't think it's a great idea to name and shame they honestly believe they will sort the problem but there will always be folk who speed, use there mobiles, park badly, etc,etc.  they will probably be fair weather volunteer's so we wont see a great deal of them.

There are some names and faces on page two of this week's Gazette.