General Discussion

Newton Abbot Lib Dem Parliamentary Candidate announced

People

Plod
Cavinpakar
Markjones918
Jej67@hotmail.co.uk
hyde
davidmalan777
Diana Mond
Hinotekmachines
jc
Pamhamill57
Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 11:40

have select local girl from Abbotskerswell Marie Chadwick to be their candidate 4

 

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 11:51

Local girl? Pretty patronising. Unless she's still at school.

 

Reminds me of this:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/08/stop-calling-women-girls-its-either-patronising-or-sexually-suggestive

 

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 12:07

Perhaps you've got a point, Indy Scot. However, it's an expression used in common parlance and - given also that she is a generation younger than both David and I - you can be assured it is one that Marie would be happy to hear said about her. 

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 12:26

The minister for women and inequalities in 2015 objected to it and rightly so. She wasn't happy being referred to as a 'girl'. 

Assuring me that your female candidate is happy being called a 'girl' is just digging a deeper hole. And I assure you it does her no favours.

 

Would you call a male candidate who is the same age as candidate Chadwick a boy?

 

And 'an expression of common parlance'? Cllr Cox made an error by posting it. Politicians should be more on the ball with the language they use.

 

It's an interesting article, it might be beneficial to help the Lib Dems understand and relate to younger female voters. 

 

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 13:13

To call someone a girl or a boy is one thing, Indy Scot. To use the expression 'local girl' (regional variation, 'local lass') or 'local boy' (rv, 'local lad') is another.

 

As I am sure you are aware, it is generally and widely used in an endearing sense for someone who has by their own efforts done well. In this sense, I look forward to its continued use in common English phraseology.

 

 

1 Agree
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 13:48

@Gary Taylor the 'local' prefix is irrelevant. the issue is the word 'girl'.

You could've just left it at 'Perhaps you've got a point' - but you choose to keep digging that hole... You just re-posted a Tweet that's all. So why identify so strongly with what a Cllr in Teignmouth posted on Twitter?

Is it worth it? I'm not suggesting there was any malice behind using the word 'girl' but it does have patronising and sexist connotations, especially to feminists. A lot of people aren't aware of this but I'd expect politicians to be more savvy about all sectors of the community they represent.

 

'local girl/lass/boy' - "it is generally and widely used in an endearing sense for someone who has by their own efforts done well"

 

What? So if a woman does well by their own efforts then the expression we use in common English phraseology is  'local girl'? 

I don't think so. Why not use 'successful woman' instead?

I've heard 'good girl' or 'good boy' being used in that context by sexist, patronizing individuals. 

 

Maybe Cllr Cox and Cllr Taylor are just too old skool?

 

leatash
leatash
07 May 2017 14:01

How about MAID, a local maid as used in local phraseology 

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 14:03

So if Marie Chadwick wins a seat in parliament the Speaker of the House would refer to her as the 'right honourable Maid for Newton Abbot'? Or whatever local phraseology is relevant to the Speakers home town or Westminster?

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 14:27

Quite, Leatash. Lovely to hear it in common usage in Devon.

 

But on one point I can at least agree with Indy Scot (quoting from the article he refers to above) "... it's not girls that run the world - although one day it may be women."

 

1 Agree
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 14:31

@Gary Taylor thank you for keeping us entertained, you never fail to make us laugh here. very Partridge-esque with a dose of David Brent too! 

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 14:40

David Brent? You haven't seen the dance yet!

 

As for Alan Partridge, Coogan describes his character as "a little Englander, with right-wing values and poor taste." Aside from the latter (especially when it comes to tee-shirts) I think you must be thinking of somebody else. 

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 14:48

@Gary Taylor it may be from the article i referenced but i do not agree with that quote. that's misrepresentation.

 

It'd be better if the world was governed with egalitarianism rather than one sex ruling and the other not. Presently it is still man's world with much work to do to redress that imbalance.

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 14:55

Regarding the quote, Indy Scot, it is not misrepresentation - it is simply that you are trying to face both ways at the same time.

 

As for your second point, I am sure even the likes of Alan Partridge would agree with that.

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 14:57

You needn't have taken the quote down, I'm not going to call the cops or my lawyer. Rest easy.

 

Why don't you cite your references? Did  you just check whether you're anything like Alan Partridge on wikipedia or something? Paranoid.

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 15:10

It is misrepresentation as I never wrote that I agree with that quote, that was your opinion. As you deleted the quote this conversation now lacks a reference point.

 

And 'trying to face both ways at the same time' once more can you clarify what you mean?

 

You removed the Steve Coogan quote about his character being right-wing and a little Englander too. Why? I just wanted to read the article. So what if Partridge was right-wing and a little Englander. Lots of people are.

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 15:13

Call who you like, IS, the quote's still up there. 

 

But here it is again, because I believe it is worth repeating: "... it's not girls that run the world - although one day it may be women."

1 Agree
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 15:15

so it is, I hadn't scrolled up enough.

 

Hey they're both back up there. Bizarre.

 

I'm not calling anyone, I can take a little misrepresentation, you needn't have removed the women ruling the world post in the first place.

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 15:21

Have you tried Specsavers? No really, that's three times on the trot you have wrongly accused me of removing posts and - I don't know about anyone else but - I'm growing a little weary of it.

1 Agree
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 15:23

Yes but it's hard to keep up with your editing and re-editing. Growing weary, have you tried a nap?

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 15:26

But coming back to your point about misrepresentation, are you now telling me that you do not agree with the quote repeated above from the article you posted?

1 Agree
Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 15:36

Hard to keep up with MY editing and re-editing? OK, let's call it a day.

1 Agree
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 15:37

Ar you kidding me?

 

I'll copy and paste what I wrote at 14:48

 

@Gary Taylor it may be from the article i referenced but i do not agree with that quote. that's misrepresentation.
 
It'd be better if the world was governed with egalitarianism rather than one sex ruling and the other not. Presently it is still man's world with much work to do to redress that imbalance.
 
which was in relation to @Gary Taylor's post at 14:27
 
But on one point I can at least agree with Indy Scot (quoting from the article he refers to above) "... it's not girls that run the world - although one day it may be women."
 

The misrepresentation made was stating that you and I agree with the point made from that quotation. 

 

Maybe the world may be run by women - but you can't assume I agree or disagree with that sentiment made by Beyonce Knowles. My point of views was in fact something very different as I believe it perpetuates a them and us culture.

 

I referenced an article as it was of interest and relevance to the use of the word 'girl' in relation to adult females. I don't agree with everything the author writes and the closing sentence about who rules the world let the author down in my opinion.

Gary Taylor
Gary Taylor
07 May 2017 16:31

Touche. Yep, you got me. The contest spun on the use of the word 'now' instead of 'really' in my post of 15:26. Note to self: must try harder.

 

So there we have it, a woman (and a local woman at that) Marie Chadwick (nee Jenkins) will be taking on the mighty Anne-Marie Morris in the General Election on June 8th. I am confident she will take the fight to the wire (as will all the LD team) and I would hope that all Lib Dem supporters - and for that matter everyone who feels that a massive Tory majority is not in the Country's best interests at a critical time in its history - will turn out and vote for Marie.

 

More soon...

1 Agree
Lindapetherick
Lindapetherick
07 May 2017 17:39

I don't have a problem with the expression local girl, my husband always refers to himself as a local boy born and bred in Dawlish.   She will give Anne Marie a run for her money

2 Agrees
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 17:44

Forget the local part. It was about referring to women as 'girls' and how it can be patronising, sexist and demeaning.

@Lindapetherick you're entitled to your opinion as a member of the public, but other sections of society disagree with the word 'girl' being used to refer to a woman as highlighted in the article referenced and they expect politicians at all levels of government, to recognize and use the appropriate language and to set a good example for wider society.

 

It shouldn't be overlooked just because the Cllr who wrote it is a Lib Dem and they just happen to be challenging the Tories in the General Election. It's about a much wider societal issue, respect and equality..

Dawlish.com is pretty tribal when it comes to party lines.

I know a guy who calls  his wife 'bird' - and he calls other women 'birds' too. That's in common parlance, but it doesn't mean it should be used to address a candidate for parliament or any women for that matter.

 

leatash
leatash
07 May 2017 17:49

Well my vote at general elections has always been tactical but as i am a brexit voter and my partys' leader is a total waste of time the tories it will be, my father will turn in his grave.  As a child and until i left home we stood every night, before bed, and listened to the Red Flag sorry dad but needs must.

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 18:00

Brexit will happen anyway, the only parties offering a second referendum are the Lib Dems and the Greens.

Labour isn't opposing Brexit and Corbyn reintroduced the Red Flag after the Blair Brown years. Labour began selling out under Callaghan, years ago.

I understand people's view of Corbyn and the right-wing press hasn't helped him, but why switch to the Tories? The election is about more than just Brexit.

 

leatash
leatash
07 May 2017 19:17

Not for me its not i want a complete divorce from the EU with full border controls and back to a Britain that is governed from Whitehall and there are thousands like me and we will put this goverment back in power to carry out the will of the people.

4 Agrees
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 19:23

So you want a Britain to continue to be governed from Whitehall by an increasingly far right-wing Tory government. 

 

I thought this Tory government only carried out the will of the very rich and powerful people in society.

1 Agree
leatash
leatash
07 May 2017 21:04

Well Indy Scot my dad worked down the pit, me i spent my life in the Army and we need to shake this country by its roots and get it on track again and we may just have a leader who can take us part way there. Could you honestly see Corbyn as a leader? The man is a coward, who finds it hard to even wear a poppy or bow his head at the Cenotaph, a man who sympathised with the IRA and would not use nuclear weapons if needed.  Now this is my last post as i am off touring the delights of the Lake District and then the Highlands await me, but i will be back for polling day to put my X next to the name MORRIS.

4 Agrees
From The Grave
From The Grave
07 May 2017 22:32

Leatash. I know you're on holiday now, but I agree with you.

 

Your father will definitely be spinning in his grave.

 

Sacrificing our NHS and public services because of your dislike of Europeans, well that's frankly bizarre. As is your blind belief of the crap you read about Corbyn in the mainstream media.

1 Agree
vicks
vicks
07 May 2017 22:55

Blind belief of the crap read about Corbyn?! You do not have to read it, just watch his interviews. Also listen to the interviews of the Shadow Home Secretary, the delightful and patronising Dianne Abbott MP. These people are putting themselves up for Government. God help us, do I really need to say more?

 

1 Agree
Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 23:19

@leatash enjoy the highlands. you'll probably need to apply for a visa to get into scotland in a few years. by then it'll be 'foreign', so that might be off-putting to some voters.

 

Do you really think Theresa May is a leader? She's just a puppet on a string for the powerful corporations, banking institutions and the elite in this country and their Trumpian allies. They'll shake this country by its roots alright and then bleed it dry.

Institutionalized military personnel may be easy prey for right-wing media propagandists and their anti-Corbyn rhetoric, automatons blindly believing in this construct called 'Great Britain' hardly equates to informed citizens with independence of thought.

The training is thorough, and their obedience to the establishment is ingrained. They're victims, pawns in a geo-political game. I feel sorry for them.

 

 

Andrew
Andrew
07 May 2017 23:45

@vicks Most politicians are patronising. e.g. johnson, farage, rees-mogg, clegg, may...etc

All the right-wing media spin just detracts from policies. It should not be about personality. We're not voting for our favourite actor. In any case Corbyn gives some very impressive public speeches, but they're just not broadcast on the biased BBC or Murdoch's Sky. 

 

I don't know how any rational being if given the 20 point plan to read would then say 'nah I'll vote Tory, I think we should dismantle and privatize public healthcare, public services and erode our civil rights'.

 

So many people just regurgitate the crap they watch on TV or read in the right-wing press, they can't even think for themselves any more. They're victims really.

 

Corbyn has made 5 main errors;

 

1) Not explaining why Labour and all political parties have failed over the past 40 years of neoliberalism - that's the real issue not Brexit or the crash in 2008. It's much deeper.

2) Not ousting the Blairites

3) Not setting Labour on a clear anti-neoliberal course (a new alternative political ideology)

4) Not campaigning for PR and an elected second chamber

5) In ths late stage not accepting the need for a Progressive Alliance, (Tactical Voting)

 

Despite all of this he at least stands for change which benefits the less fortunate and marginalised in society and is a decent human being with compassion and empathy for others, unlike May and her corporate cronies.

Hating or disliking Corbyn's personality or lack of finesse is no reason to hand the keys to Downing Street back to the Tories. 

 

This is a historic election, I would not want to be someone who looks back in years to come having voted Tory in 2017.

 

And 'God helps us'?  You might be asking that after another 5 years of Tory governance. You might even wonder if there is a God.

 

HuwMatthews2
HuwMatthews2
08 May 2017 01:38

@Indy Scot

Is there anyone that you won't throw insults at?

Everyone who disagrees with your simplistic ideology seems to be fair game to you.

 

As I said before - Troll!

5 Agrees
Andrew
Andrew
08 May 2017 11:30

@HuwMatthews2

 

Who have I personally thrown insults at on here? And yes, I know you think I'm a troll, you constantly tell me on various threads which is beginning to appear troll-like.

 

You clearly dislike corbyn as much as @leatash and anyone who disagrees with your spurious views that he is a traitor seems to be fair game to you. That is where this all started isn't it? Your post is hypocritical.

 

If you disagree with my 'simplistic ideology' (whatever that means) then contest it - If you're capable of presenting a balanced, rational counter argument. Are you? Enlighten me, I'd love to hear about your advanced, sophisticated ideology..

Or are you just going to keep calling 'Troll!' - Is that all you've got? Pathetic.

 

You have the option to report me, if you think your complaint can be substantiated. Otherwise this will just get very tedious indeed.

HuwMatthews2
HuwMatthews2
08 May 2017 15:38

@Indy Scot

 

QED!

Comment Please sign in or sign up to post